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Thread: im better off on UC than i was on ESA.

  1. #1

    im better off on UC than i was on ESA.

    hi i moved address so had to claim UC.
    before i was on ESA / SUPPORT GROUP and was getting £546pcm.
    now im on UC/LWCRA and get £637pcm.
    to work this out you times your ESA weekly amount by 52 and divide by 12 giving you a PCM amount.
    you can then compare the UC that is paid PCM .

    if you get the SDP amount added to your ESA you need to try and stay on ESA but for those like me who are just getting ordinary ESA / SUPPORT GROUP then your more than likely around £90pcm worse off by staying on ESA (yes suprisng given the scare stories around UC)..
    there are some differences to UC than ESA , being paid monthly might not suit everyone (need to budget more).
    but there are some plus bits , if you want to move NO more form filling! just change your address on your UC account and produce your new proof of rent/address at JC.(sorted).
    your only contact with council is to do with council tax (councils are not paying HB in future).
    there is one thing i have noticed though and that is today i was told in the new year im to be reassessed? , ESA never use to notify me of reassessment dates , but UC has? now ive thought for a long time that moving on to UC might trigger a medical (but under the rules this alone shouldnt) so maybe i was due to be retested? or maybe UC has a different criteria for testing claiments?? so they need to see if i qualify for LWCRA under a more rigerous test? . OR maybe im to be tested and be one of the ones to be told that i no longer will need to be retested EVER? (the no need to ever be retested is ment to be the new SG) .?.
    that brings me onto another intresting theory ! in the past ive sat down and filled out ESA50s and been told i STILL need a F2F , this has also led on one occasion to me having to appeal a decision that i was assumed fit to work , WELL that means they NEVER read these ESA50s (now UC50s) SO im going to put my name address NI number and just write NO CHANGE!! and send it back , the result will be the same , just no stress for me filling out this form that will end up in some dwp bin..
    i have kept the last report there doctors did on me and will produce it as and ware needed , if they want to run around in circles FINE but this guy is not for playing there games anymore , i have enough evidence to sink 2 battle ships and im quiet happy to stand in court and make them look stupid AGAIN (amen)

  2. #2
    I’m not 100% sure on the maths here, how did you work out your ESA pcm?

  3. #3
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    It should be pointed out that you cannot volunteer to change from ESA to UC.

    Druid was migrated to UC because he moved house and made a new claim for help with housing (rental) costs.
    Because he moved to a Full service UC area this had to be a new claim for UC housing element, which meant that any other Income Related benefits got migrated into UC.

    Be careful to check this out before trying the same.
    It is only this very particular circumstance of ESA SG with EDP only that will find themseves better off migrating to UC.

    If you have the SDP then avoid this like the plague - wait until you are 'Managed Migrated' a few years from now, at which time you will get Transitional Protection and so will not be worse off.

    And yes, you have to be very careful working out the PCM equivalent, it's not quite as simple as 52 weeks and 12 months.
    There are more than 52 weeks in a year. (And don't forget leap years).

    I did a simple comparision for various ESA/UC rates using a comparision weekly rate (52.143 weeks in a non-leap year) which gives a slightly more accurate result, you can see the results here:
    http://www.youreable.com/forums/show...l=1#post137494

    This has worked for druid and he is now better off on UC than he was on ESA.
    It should work for others moving house in the same circumstances, (SG+EDP only), but you have to be careful with whether it's a private or social rental (private rentals only pay LHA rates).
    Again - check carefully before considering it.
    Last edited by nukecad; 12-23-2017 at 01:41 AM.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  4. #4
    Thanks nuke. Yeah I thought it would be a rather low amount of people that fit into it.

    Fingers crossed UC will be fixed (and pay a fairer amount- especially to those whom cannot work) within the next few years, though this government doesn’t seem particularly bothered about people’s welfare

  5. #5
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobcarerT View Post
    Thanks nuke. Yeah I thought it would be a rather low amount of people that fit into it.
    I'm not sure just how many are getting SG with EDP only, and so will be better off with UC.

    I'll fire off an FoI request, but I suspect that the DWP will claim that they don't know either, it's amazing how they don't collate information like this.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobcarerT View Post
    Fingers crossed UC will be fixed (and pay a fairer amount- especially to those whom cannot work) within the next few years, though this government doesn’t seem particularly bothered about people’s welfare
    Most people transfering from ESA to UC will not see any change to their payments. (Apart from being monthly).
    Especially those made to change over by 'Managed Migration'.

    The winners will be those like druid with SG+EDP only, they will get more money.

    The big losers will be those with the SDP who are 'Naturally Migrated' before June/July 2019. Or whenever they get round to moving everyone to UC.
    (There will also be a very small group with WRAG+EDP only who will loose out if 'Naturally Migrated').


    Anyone 'Managed Migrated' after July 2019 will be guarenteed to be no worse off on UC than they were on ESA.

    The longer the 'Managed Migration' is delayed the more people with SDP who are going to fall in this trap.
    I suspect that this will not affect many people. (But will, and already has, generated a lot of shouting online).
    At the moment the main trigger is if you move house and so make a new UC housing claim.
    But if you do get caught then that's one too many for you.
    Last edited by nukecad; 12-23-2017 at 03:27 PM.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  6. #6
    I knew support group got more on UC if you don't get SDP but what about housing benefit does that go down?

  7. #7
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toby123 View Post
    I knew support group got more on UC if you don't get SDP but what about housing benefit does that go down?
    No.

    If you are in Social Housing then the UC housing element will pay the full rent, just like Housing Benefit does.

    If you are in a private rental it will pay the LHA rate for that area.
    The LHA rate is a set rate for the area.
    LHA rate is the same for UC housing element as it is for Housing Benefit.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  8. #8
    Thanks nukecad,it was just I read someone said they take a percentage from your HB when on UC,so I can stop stressing now.

  9. #9
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toby123 View Post
    Thanks nukecad,it was just I read someone said they take a percentage from your HB when on UC,so I can stop stressing now.
    They are probably talking about the benefit cap.

    If your benefit payments exceed the cap then it is the UC housing element, or Housing Benefit, that gets reduced.

    The benefit cap does not apply to you if - you have ESA Support Group, or a LCWRA element on UC, or DLA/PIP, or various other disability related benefits.
    https://www.gov.uk/benefit-cap/when-youre-not-affected
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  10. #10
    80% of people in SG dont get SDP so they would be £90 a month better off on UC .
    housing benifit is called housing costs in UC and is seperate to your UC rate unless you reach the "cap" (this mostly effects people in the south east) .
    if your renting in the private sector you can find your housing costs rates here > https://lha-direct.voa.gov.uk/search.aspx just fill in your post code and that will tell you the max you can claim for that postcode.
    if your in social housing you will get your rent paid (bedroom tax may apply) but you wont be able to claim for surcharges that include heating/hot water.
    the only "hicup" im digging into is that im being retested soon after claiming UC they claim even if stayed on ESA my retest date would of been the same.
    im going to call ESA asap to see if they can confirm this.
    also another thing i want to know is if the SG criteria is the same in UC as it was in ESA.

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