Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 20 of 20

Thread: Passed WCA and put into LCWRA group. When shouldl I receive first payment?

  1. #11
    ah the infamous 'learn as we go' approach of the gov/dwp
    perhaps Esther M would like to man the dwp phones for a day or two

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by nukecad View Post
    That is not correct, but it's too late to do anything about it now you have claimed UC.

    It happens, welfare advisors see it happening all the time, but it's difficult to make a court case to challenge it.
    There's no way to prove you were given incorrect advice by the Jobcentre, it's always verbal and never in writing.

    To be generous, the DWP frontline staff are only telling you what they have been told by their 'bosses' - so they believe that what they are telling you is true.

    Only making a brand new claim for an IR benefit means you have to make a UC claim.
    Becoming sick on an existing claim does not do that. (Unless someone cons you into it).

    The main reason for making a brand new claim for an IR benefit is moving house to a different Local Authority area, or if a Contribution Based benefit runs out after a set time.

    Sorry, but once you do make a UC claim then that's it, you are on UC.
    yes its awful how there pushing people onto UC that could of claimed ESA (if they want).
    some of those staff in JCs dont show any intrest in learnig the rules , there tends to be 1 member of staff in each "team" that has half a clue and they refer any "difficult" questions to that member.
    i like everything written in blood.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by druid View Post
    yes its awful how there pushing people onto UC that could of claimed ESA (if they want).
    some of those staff in JCs dont show any intrest in learnig the rules , there tends to be 1 member of staff in each "team" that has half a clue and they refer any "difficult" questions to that member.
    i like everything written in blood.
    Wow! So I've been conned?? Why does that not surprise me?!!

    TBH I just believed the JSA work coach when he said that new ESA claims could no longer be made and that I had no choice but to claim UC if I was still too ill to claim JSA after the 13 weeks extended period of sickness. After all, they know their job better than we do right?.......wrong?!!

    My JC is telling everyone that new claims cannot be made for old benefits like ESA, etc, and that ALL new claims or triggers which move you from one benefit to another such as becoming ill on JSA, automatically move you onto claiming UC because my JC is in a UC full service area.

    I should have known better than to trust a government department!

  4. #14
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    West Cumbria (Lake District)
    Posts
    8,088
    As I say you can't realy blame the work coaches, they believe that what they have been told in their training is true. Why wouldn't they?
    Just like you believed what the work coach told you. Why wouldn't you?

    It's true that you can't claim old Income Related benefits in a FS UC area, so new claims have to be UC.
    It's true that certain changes of circumstance will migrate your existing benefits to UC - if the change means that you have to make a new claim.
    (Moving house, CB benefit running out, etc).

    It's not true that all changes of circumstance will mean you have to make a new claim.
    But the WC's aren't told that in their training, or if they are it's glossed over.

    Of course UC staff are taught about UC, so either they don't know the rules about the old benefits or if they were existing staff have been told that they no longer apply.
    (And to be honest they often didn't know all the rules for the old benefits either).

    These rules are written down, in legislation and in DWP guidance, but the front line jobcentre staff are not told about all of them. They are only taught the basic stuff that they will need day to day.
    Some do learn when they see non-basic situations happen.

    The DWP excuse (if they bother to make one) is that the frontline staff will rarely come across 'that situation' and if they do then a Decision Maker will know the rules and put it right. (If you know what they have done is wrong and to ask for a MR).
    Of course with 'natural' migration to UC by the time it gets to a DM it's too late, you have already made the UC claim and can't go back.

    And the general benefit principle still stands - It's up to you to know what you can or can't, should or shouldn't, claim. (Which is why £millions in benefit goes unclaimed).

    So you can't blame the frontline staff, they believe that they are telling you the truth.
    They are being conned into conning you.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  5. #15
    the JC staff i have spoke to "assured" me of lots of things , the basics like there name and what day it was i believed them , everything else i checked out

  6. #16
    Well the UC Service Centre have today repeated that the 3 month wait begins from when the LCWRA is awarded and not sooner so I am getting nowhere with them.

    Is there an organisation I can go to who could help me (CAB or Welfare Rights?). Maybe I should contact Esther McVey?!

  7. #17
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    West Cumbria (Lake District)
    Posts
    8,088
    Get back on to them and ask for a 'Manadtory Reconsideration' of the decision not to backpay you.

    They will probably try to say that you can't ask for an MR because there has been no decision to challenge.
    Happens all the time, if they won't take it from the UC journal then write and send them a letter.
    Stick by your guns, tell them that they have made a decision - not to backpay - and you are legally entitled to challenged that decision.
    (Again happens a lot and they back down once they realise you know your rights).

    Tell them to look at their own guidance - "Advice for Decision Makers", Chapter F5, sections F5030, F5031, and Example 1.

    I gave the text of that in post #8: https://www.youreable.com/forums/sho...l=1#post148803

    They can't reasonably argue with their own guidance.

    To find local help try putting your postcode in here for advice centres local to you:
    https://advicelocal.uk/find-an-adviser
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  8. #18
    Just thought I'd throw a silly question into the ring for you Nukecad…


    You said " Becoming sick on an existing claim does not do that. (Unless someone cons you into it). "



    Would this also apply to someone on Income Support and Carers Allowance if they were awarded PIP, or would they have to make a new claim for Universal Credit?

  9. #19
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    West Cumbria (Lake District)
    Posts
    8,088
    I'm not sure just what you are asking there Priffy?

    PIP has nothing whatsoever to do with UC, it is not an Income Related benefit.

    I think you are asking that if you were awarded PIP, and so became entitled to Disability Premiums on your existing benefit, would this trigger a new UC claim?

    The answer to that is NO.

    Any disablilty premiums that now became due would simply be added to the existing claim.
    It's a change of circumstances to an existing claim, not a brand new claim.

    I think the problem understanding this is with the term "Change of Circumstances".
    Some changes mean that you have to make a brand new claim for IR benefit. - Others are just a change to your existing benefit.
    So it depends on just what the C of C is.

    It is only brand new claims for an Income Related benefit that have to be UC. (In full Service areas).

    It's the making of this brand new claim, that then triggers the migration of your other IR benefits.
    If you don't make the brand new claim then nothing else changes.

    The most common trigger for Natural Migration to UC for those already on ESA/IS/IB is a brand new claim for Housing Costs, which usually only happens because you have moved house to a different Local Authority.

    The other reason is if you have been awarded New Style CB ESA in WRAG; that runs out after 12 months and you then have to make a UC claim if you still want benefits. (Although you would probably already have a UC claim open anyway in those circumstances).
    As previously if you get New Style CB ESA in Support Group that remains NS-ESA as long as you are in Support Group.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  10. #20
    Many thanks Nukecad, I had been wondering about that.

Similar Threads

  1. In Support Group no payment since 18/4/16
    By Popeye in forum Benefits - help & advice on disability benefits, incapacity benefits, ESA and DLA
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 06-07-2016, 07:35 PM
  2. How soon after DWP receive paperwork will I receive decision?
    By mjjcbishop in forum Benefits - help & advice on disability benefits, incapacity benefits, ESA and DLA
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-12-2016, 07:09 AM
  3. If you are in the ESA support group do you automatically receive housing benefit
    By Jamesholland235 in forum Benefits - help & advice on disability benefits, incapacity benefits, ESA and DLA
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 10-19-2015, 10:50 AM
  4. MOT passed first time. now for service.
    By carl30 in forum Motoring - help & advice on cars for disabled people, Blue Badge and Motability
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 07-13-2015, 12:18 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •