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Thread: UC Overpayment?

  1. #1

    UC Overpayment?

    Hello,

    I've been on UC since 12/12/18 as gainfully self employed getting my payments as normal.

    I applied for PIP (for my mother) in Nov 18 due to my mothers health deteriorating. I was her carer, but not on carers allowance and didn't mention it in my universal credit application stage as i received no other benefit at the time.

    She was awarded in April 19 and then I found out I could apply for carers allowance and during the application stage it asked if I would like it to be backdated to when the person you care for was entitled PIP from, which I put down Nov 18, which got backdated successfully.

    Now, UC are saying I owe them money 68% of it with no civil penalties. I can appeal and take it as far as a tribunal.

    To, my understanding carers allowance and universal credit are separate entities. I care for the 35 hours per week and also work on my business.

    Any advice.

  2. #2
    Carer's Allowance is seen as income for Universal Credit purposes and is deducted from your UC payment. As a carer in receipt of Carer's Allowance, you receive a Carer's Premium with your Universal Credit, which is why they only want 68% of it back.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by noisynoodle View Post
    Carer's Allowance is seen as income for Universal Credit purposes and is deducted from your UC payment. As a carer in receipt of Carer's Allowance, you receive a Carer's Premium with your Universal Credit, which is why they only want 68% of it back.
    That's fine going forward, but why do they count backdated payments?

    And what are the implications of not paying it back? Can they arrest you?

  4. #4
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Carers allowance is deducted £ for £ from UC as 'Income' (Just as it is from IR ESA).

    So any CA paid since you claimed UC should have been deducted from the UC.
    The fact that you only got it backpaid later doesn't matter, it should/would have been paid at the time if you had claimed it so is deductable.

    They can't ask for all the CA back because any of it payable from before you were claiming UC obviously couldn't have been deducted from UC as you didn't have UC at the time.

    However you should also get the UC carer allowance of £160.20 a month.
    As you have (effectively) had CA from the start of your UC claim then the Carer Element should have been included in your UC payments form the start.
    Of course you didn't (physically) have it then, so you may have to push UC to now get that element of UC backdated to the start of your UC claim.

    (As its an 'element' it doesn't have to be claimed in it's own right so there should be no limit on backdating it to when you first became eligible. ie. to when your UC started).
    Last edited by nukecad; 05-13-2019 at 07:07 PM.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by nukecad View Post
    Carers allowance is deducted £ for £ from UC as 'Income' (Just as it is from IR ESA).

    So any CA paid since you claimed UC should have been deducted from the UC.
    The fact that you only got it backpaid later doesn't matter, it should/would have been paid at the time if you had claimed it so is deductable.

    They can't ask for all the CA back because any of it payable from before you were claiming UC obviously couldn't have been deducted from UC as you didn't have UC at the time.

    However you should also get the UC carer allowance of £160.20 a month.
    As you have (effectively) had CA from the start of your UC claim then the Carer Element should have been included in your UC payments form the start.
    Of course you didn't (physically) have it then, so you may have to push UC to now get that element of UC backdated to the start of your UC claim.

    (As its an 'element' it doesn't have to be claimed in it's own right so there should be no limit on backdating it to when you first became eligible. ie. to when your UC started).
    Great info nukecad. Why is it deducted £ for £ when its not part of 6 in 1 universal credit? I was told by a CA adviser you could claim both, however your UC will be adjusted itself, but you definately be better off.

    UC Carer allowance? £160.20 a month they have reduced it to £60 per month or something? How do you come to that figure? £40.05p per week carer element?

    I will be making an appeal and taking it to a tribunal.

  6. #6
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pipsaholic View Post
    Great info nukecad. Why is it deducted £ for £ when its not part of 6 in 1 universal credit? I was told by a CA adviser you could claim both, however your UC will be adjusted itself, but you definately be better off.

    UC Carer allowance? £160.20 a month they have reduced it to £60 per month or something? How do you come to that figure? £40.05p per week carer element?

    I will be making an appeal and taking it to a tribunal.
    It's deducted £ for £ because it's not part of UC, and it's classed as 'unearned' income (yes I know).

    You are 'better off' because although the CA is wholely deducted you do get the Carer Element added to your UC.*

    The UC rates and elements can be found here:
    https://www.focusondisability.org.uk...2019-2020.html
    Note that there is a heading missing, look underneath 'Disabled Child additions' and you'll see the LCW, LCWRA, and Carer elements (with a blank line where the heading should be).

    *You don't need to be claiming CA to get the carer element in UC, just caring for someone 35 hours or more.
    If you scroll down the page of that above link you'll see:
    Carer element

    You can get this if you are caring for a severely disabled person for at least 35 hours a week. You will not be allowed to get this element together with a capability for work element even if you are eligible for both. You do not have to claim carer's allowance to get this element.
    So you could probably drop the CA claim, although having it does prove you have carer responsibilities.
    More information here:
    https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Ca...iversal-Credit

    This is also going to be complicated by the fact that you say you are self employed.

    You do know that there is a pretty low limit (£123/week) on what you can earns and still claim CA?
    https://www.gov.uk/carers-allowance/eligibility

    That earnings limit doesn't exist in UC.
    But you may have to explain how you can be caring more than 35 hrs, and working self employed.
    Last edited by nukecad; 05-13-2019 at 11:31 PM.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  7. #7
    wow. Does the UC online application ask you if your a carer that you may be entitled to carers allowance element? I can't remember if it asked as my intention was to be self employed of 35 hours per week. I thought UC had nothing to do with carers. I was told that carers allowance is seperate from UC!


    Well, the self employment business is home based along with caring duties if and when required. I mind in the rules of the law being available for care and being present in the proximity of the individual is counted as caring safeguarding duties its called. Some agencies pay £100 per day to sit with vulnerable people or even stay overnight for safety incase they fall or need assistance.
    Last edited by pipsaholic; 05-15-2019 at 09:55 PM.

  8. #8
    they will not take you to court , they tend to deduct repayments from your monthly UC

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