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Thread: Chancellor £1000 UC 12 month pledge.

  1. #51
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by worried33 View Post
    housebound people like myself are struggling to get delivery slots because I am not on that list.
    So why haven't you registered to go on that list?
    https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-extremely-vulnerable
    Mmm, I see that they have changed that page.

    I've aready explained why the decrease in WRAG (for both ESA and UC) was not discrimination, and why this new legislation is discrimination.
    Sorry if you can't get your head around it, but the legal distinction does exist.

    It's not about 'me to' and grasping for extra money, it's the plain and simple discrimination which is against the law.


    As I said above if the Chancellor had done it the correct way then there would be no discrimination and so no problem.
    But he has done it in a way that is illegal, and so it should be corrected one way or the other in order to comply with law.
    Now is not the right time to do that, but it must be done at some time in future when things have calmed down again.
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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau View Post
    I am on UC LCWRA ( no pip etc ) and I was surprised to find out I’ll be getting an extra £20 a week but TBH it’s absolutely the least of my issues ATM during this terrible crisis and if it was retracted so be it I’ve managed up till now without it . I understand that the issue is about fairness / discrimination but it just feels that it’s not the time to be up in arms when we’re dealing with this pandemic.
    I don't see anyone 'up in arms' but it was merely pointed out.

    However, for some, they are struggling on what they have. And it's hard as you have to put in a bulk order online when you can finally get a slot as you can only get one every three weeks or so, so some people only have their carers allowance and IS, and it's not enough to have a lot leftover for a big food shop. It doesn't make them grabby, as some seem to think, that their counterparts on UC, for no explained reason will be £80 a month better off. That money can really help at this time for them too.

  3. #53
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    Hi guys hope ur all ok considering the circumstances of late... Just quick question this xtra money were rold everyone is getting in their universal credit on 6th april... What happens if u normally get paid on 4th april... Will u get an xtra payment seperate or will i have to wait till may's payment... Plus will same apply to the normal rise were getting

  4. #54
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    The clause in the legislation reads:

    Universal credit – standard allowance modification

    3.—(1) Regulation 36 (table showing amounts of elements) of the Universal Credit Regulations, as amended by article 33 of, and Schedule 13 to, the Social Security Benefits Up-rating Order 2020 (“the 2020 up-rating order”) is to be read as if the following amounts were substituted for the amounts of the standard allowance—

    (a)£342.72 for a single claimant aged under 25;

    (b)£409.89 for a single claimant aged 25 or over;

    (c)£488.59 for joint claimants both aged under 25;

    (d)£594.04 for joint claimants where either is aged 25 or over.

    (2) This regulation takes effect in relation to each award of universal credit from the day specified in article 1(3)(o) of the 2020 up-rating order and continues to have effect only for the remainder of the tax year beginning with 6th April 2020.

    (3) For the purposes of any calculation under regulation 54 (transitional element - indicative UC amount) and 55 (transitional element – initial amount and adjustment where other elements increase) of the Universal Credit (Transitional Provisions) Regulations 2014(9) the amount of the standard allowance is to be the amount specified in regulation 36 of the Universal Credit Regulations, as amended by the 2020 up-rating order, and paragraph (1) is to be disregarded.
    What that means is that the annual UC uprating amounts that were due on 6th April have now been changed to the amounts shown there.

    The uprating will apply from the start of your UC assessment period following the 6th April, and will first be paid at the end of that assessment period.

    So in your particular case:
    If you're due to get paid on the 4th April then that means that you assessment period runs from the 29th of one month to the 28th of the next.
    (You get paid 7 days after the end of your assessment period).
    So your uprating will apply from the assessment period 29 April to 28th May, and you personally will first see the rise in your payment on 5th June and then for another 11 payments until the new 2021 rates come into force.
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  5. #55
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Things get more bizarre with this particular legislation.

    There has been a letter from Neil Couling posted today on rightsnet stating the the pilot of Managed Migration to UC has been suspended.
    https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/forums/viewthread/15831/

    Which means that clause 3(3) regarding Managed Migrations was not needed, it will only apply to the few (13 or so?) people who have already been Managed Migrated.
    Everyone on UC will get the rise apart from those few who have already Managed Migrated as part of the pilot.

    So unless they start Managed Migrations again within the next 12 months then 3(3) is virtually meaningless.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Careruk26 View Post
    Just switch to UC to get the extra £20 a week?

    It's not as simple as you've put.

    First off with 500,000 claims in just a few days, do you think there would be time for them to process claims coming from someone who want to switch over? It could be months, even a year before the system is able to deal with not so essential things like that.

    Secondly, moving to UC can be distressing for many especially without managed migration.

    People are unwell with a variety of different problems. We are all different remember. Many wont be coping day to day due to things like mental health problems and when it's like that, it's hard to go through another process due to struggling to focus or deal with extra things.

    I, like many on ESA struggle with Asperger's as well. From what I understand UC is paid monthly right? Well that would throw me right off and put me in a mess having to then adapt from payment every 2 weeks payments to 4 weeks. It might sound trivial to you but honestly adapting to even something like that is distressing.

    If (when) I'm forced onto UC then I will have to face it when the time comes but I'm not going to volunteer to put myself into more distress for the sake of £20 a week.

    From what others have said, it seems that yes, people on legacy benefits should be getting that increase too. I'm not fussed but if it was offered, I'd accept it because afterall, that £20 could even be put in a jar, ready in case my next assessment doesn't go well. If the worst outcome happens then that jar could well be my money to buy food with while I figure out what to do next.
    As a benefit recipient I know its not quick and easy, but its a path people can take if they choose to. Now if there was no avenue for people on legacy benefits to move to UC, then I could see the point of discrimination although I do still think at this time during the virus outbreak its not a good idea but there would be a point then. People on SDP who dont have a migration path, cant really cry foul, because they already get significantly more money. That includes myself.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by nukecad View Post
    So why haven't you registered to go on that list?
    https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-extremely-vulnerable
    Mmm, I see that they have changed that page.

    I've aready explained why the decrease in WRAG (for both ESA and UC) was not discrimination, and why this new legislation is discrimination.
    Sorry if you can't get your head around it, but the legal distinction does exist.

    It's not about 'me to' and grasping for extra money, it's the plain and simple discrimination which is against the law.


    As I said above if the Chancellor had done it the correct way then there would be no discrimination and so no problem.
    But he has done it in a way that is illegal, and so it should be corrected one way or the other in order to comply with law.
    Now is not the right time to do that, but it must be done at some time in future when things have calmed down again.
    I agree there is a difference, but the difference is actually in WRAG's favour not the other way round.

    The government would argue those on legacy benefits, who would have less than those on UC in the same circumstances can just migrate, case won and closed, slam dunk. They would also argue those who get more on legacy benefits even eith the £20 increase such as SDP+EDP, they are already better off so cannot possibly claim discrimination, case closed.

    With WRAG someone does not have the option of moving to the older legacy benefit where the WRAG component was paid, it is plain and simple treating different sets of people differently simply based on when they started their claim, and there is no avenue for those who lose the WRAG component to get it, their only option if they want that money is to try and get in the support group. Thats clearly a stronger case for discrimination. Why has there been no legal challenge? I have noticed quite consistently the charities only raise legal challenges for the most vulnerable groups, and people in WRAG typically wouldnt fall into that category.

    In your case it would be like someone choosing to shop at asda moaning that tesco toiler paper is cheaper, and so they are been discriminated against.

    Regarding the vulnerable group thing, its a farce, the government is classifying people with specific diagnosis based on their risk to the virus, they taking no account of existing disabilities which could prevent someone doing a shop without food deliveries.
    Last edited by worried33; 30-03-20 at 18:11.

  8. #58
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    In your case it would be like someone choosing to shop at asda moaning that tesco toiler paper is cheaper, and so they are been discriminated against.


    It's absolutely nothing like that.

  9. #59
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    Hi nuke im already getting u/c and have been for a while and im not a new claimer my payments are always on the 4th of the month so based on that the rise in my payment should come into effect on the 4th of may shouldnt they as its based from end march to end april so any rise in between them dates should be paid on 4th may xx
    Last edited by kat123; 30-03-20 at 22:13.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by worried33 View Post
    I think there is a bigger problem right now, the government is sending off a list of 1.5million people to the supermarkets to use as a means for prioritising delivery slots, the flaw is that the list is based in diagnosis only (which is always a bad idea), and concentrates on identifying people deemed to be be of high risk from the virus, as a result many housebound people like myself are struggling to get delivery slots because I am not on that list.

    Ultimately been unable to get food is much more important than £80 a week, money doesnt do much if you die off starvation.

    I have been trying to get scope to start a campaign, they not interested, no supermarket CEO's replied, and no reply from MP either.

    It seems every campaign that gets started, is always about the money, thats all anyone is interested in. I still see this campaign, oh suddenly someone else is getting more money than me, I want the same, I want as much as possible, lets squeeze that taxpayer for every penny we can get. I am on ESA+EDP+PIP, I do not need this £100 for day to day living, I have no other income. It would just bolster my account and probably even take me over the £6000 threshold as well and cause unneeded complications.

    For the people who are on perhaps just base JSA or base ESA, no SDP, PIP, then just switch benefits, bam you got your extra £80 a week. This is why I dont see this as discrimination, its not even as bad as the WRAG situation, those who fail to get the WRAG component, have no option to get it, because its only available to older claimants, whilst in this case people do have an option, they can switch from legacy benefits to UC. Now I know what you might say to that, if someone on SDP got the £80 on ESA the they get to keep their SDP "and" have the £80, my reply to that, is its shameful if thats what you going to push for, pure greed. Law or not.

    Typical human reaction, to UC been boosted, is instead of saying this is good news, I am glad those people are getting help, is instead "give me a piece of that pie as well".

    Also there is a precedent, people on UC LCWRA already get more than those on IB ESA (without SDP). Where is the discrimination lawsuit on that?
    the standard rate of£73.10 has not seen any increase for years now this £20 is well overdue Every other living cost has risen in this time Take this crass government to court they are always kicking the sick and disabled

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