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Thread: Appeal today...

  1. #11
    davewhit
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikstar View Post
    Actually, not being allowed to respond, or being allowed to state one's case, can be adequate grounds for an appeal to the UT, as the tribunal might be classed as having erred in law. Failing to take into account a material fact can also be another reason.

    I have actually successfully appealed an Employment Tribunal decision on not being given the opportunity to respond and state one's case.

    Whether or not the tribunal might have been errant in law should be decided by a qualified person, and opinions should not be voiced by unqualified people on what may or may not be an error of law.
    this is a forum and no one is qualified .......my comment was just that "I" think.............. most often used and only things that matters on here is telling people to get expert advise.

    as we where not at tribunal we dont... know if they had heard enough

    you seem to forget all we have here is "opinions voiced by unqualified people "

  2. #12
    Senior Member googlybear's Avatar
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    The dictaphone was already on the table when i went in, expressly pointed out to me by the Clerk to the Tribunal. Sorry for giving the wrong impression on that. It seems all the Tribunals at the Edinburgh office are now recorded.

    Dave, if the panel don't give the opportunity to respond to something, it can mean they have not fully considered it and all available evidence, which would mean they would have erred in law. If they simply make up their minds giving weight to one side without even exploring the other side, then they might as well have made the decision before i got into the room.

    I'm minded at the moment they will most likely score me for the claimed points in that descriptor now, having thought about those implications. I also need them to find in my favour for other descriptors though, since i'm starting from 0 points this time around.

    Still no result yet, try again tomorrow...
    Last edited by googlybear; 05-01-2013 at 01:46 PM.
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by davewhit View Post
    this is a forum and no one is qualified .......my comment was just that "I" think.............. most often used and only things that matters on here is telling people to get expert advise.

    as we where not at tribunal we dont... know if they had heard enough

    you seem to forget all we have here is "opinions voiced by unqualified people "
    Opinions that are not substantiated by fact, or given a reputable reference point can be very damaging and dangerous, especially to people who post on here who have very little knowledge of the system.

    The danger is that members may take your opinion as gospel, as you are a regular poster, even though you often state IMO.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by googlybear View Post
    The dictaphone was already on the table when i went in, expressly pointed out to me by the Clerk to the Tribunal. Sorry for giving the wrong impression on that. It seems all the Tribunals at the Edinburgh office are now recorded.

    Dave, if the panel don't give the opportunity to respond to something, it can mean they have not fully considered it and all available evidence, which would mean they would have erred in law. If they simply make up their minds giving weight to one side without even exploring the other side, then they might as well have made the decision before i got into the room.

    I'm minded at the moment they will most likely score me for the claimed points in that descriptor now, having thought about those implications. I also need them to find in my favour for other descriptors though, since i'm starting from 0 points this time around.

    Still no result yet, try again tomorrow...
    That's fine then, the Tribunal's Record of Proceedings are normally written, in this case, they will probable transcribe them from the recordings. Good luck.

  5. #15
    davewhit
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikstar View Post
    Opinions that are not substantiated by fact, or given a reputable reference point can be very damaging and dangerous, especially to people who post on here who have very little knowledge of the system.

    The danger is that members may take your opinion as gospel, as you are a regular poster, even though you often state IMO.
    the danger is IMO should there even be web sites like this ? I have tried to help many but know for a fact that I think my input has only had a decent effect in three cases (based on feedback)

    anyone who takes anything on this forum or any other where we no very little about any body as anything more than a chat over a pint. is daft

    anyone coming on a forum and thinks we are the answers to all there prays are in for a shock. added tot he fact we are all guility of commenting without all the info which we will never get

    but what can we do ? just post go to cab seek expert advice ?

  6. #16
    Senior Member googlybear's Avatar
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    the Record of Proceedings transcribed from the sound file would be nice, it'll show that i didn't actually say what she said i did, but i'd much rather have a copy of the sound file, it'll illustrate the tone of the conversation, especially where the legal member seemed to be targetting my representative.

    I'm trying not to get ahead of myself here, so frustrating waiting for this result...
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  7. #17
    Can't see why they don't use a double recorder like the do in police stations?

    A question.

    Does not having a DWP member on the panel give the person appealing their decision a better chance of winning?

    I've always took it that they've realized that their decision was wrong in the first place if no DWP person is there.

  8. #18
    Senior Member googlybear's Avatar
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    The panel is independent. Nobody from the DWP should be on the panel. If there is someone from the DWP present, it would be to present their case against you, but in the 6 or 7 tribunals i've been to i've never experienced this.

    I did have opposition once at an appeal to a Commissioner, the DWP sent along 2 law advocates to present their case. I quickly felt myself out of my depth arguing against them about the law, but i had put a whole year's work into it and most of my points were already down on paper.
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  9. #19
    Senior Member googlybear's Avatar
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    This is really doing my head in now, simmering over this result. I haven't been coping too well in the weeks leading up to my hearing, i need to be put out of my misery.

    The more i think about what happened and what was said during the hearing, the more i'm beginning to realise just how bloody awful it actually was.
    The legal member conducted the hearing like a dictator. She attacked my credibility right from the outset, before i'd even said anything. She then didn't give me the opportunity to reply, until the very end of the hearing.
    Her first topic after attacking my credibility, after giving me little chance to respond, she said "that's one knocked out then". Hmmm... what could that mean?
    Illegitimi non carborundum

  10. #20
    Senior Member googlybear's Avatar
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    Got my result in the post today. I lost :-((
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